May 25th, 2010 / 1:52 pm
Snippets
Snippets
Blake Butler—
I can only think of about four bands I consider truly, aesthetically, punk. On the other hand, I can think of at least several dozen writers that are punk as fuck.
who are the bands?
Sample sentence in dictionary at hand for “punk” as an adjective: “I felt too punk to eat.”
i’m actually now having trouble even naming one i would stand by in that way across the board
I’m seeing GBH next friday.
Who are the writers
Swans, Three 6 Mafia, Talking Heads, Wire
I’ll stand behind all those.
Throwing in The Crucifucks and Guttermouth.
throbbing gristle, excepter, hair police, prurient, ornette coleman
The Feederz. The Shaggs. Devo. Harry Crews.
black fag
neil young is so punk it’s soft
Guttermouth; good addition. Saw the singer once have a hernia on stage and just down a handfull of pills from the audience, and kept on with the show.
if only all those writers started bands i mean you figure 4 guys a band suddenly you’ve increased the number of true punk outfits by 312.5%. maybe this whole punk thing will catch on after all.
converge? saw them play to an SLC crowd of about 20; jake tripped and split his head open on a step and kept screaming while blood gushed out of his head. finished the set while the ambulance waited outside
defining punk isn’t punk.
Guys, what about Green Day, right? Remember American Idiot? Those were heady days.
Ramones, Sex Pistols, Talking Heads
That’s the list
all of it
Clash
ornette coleman
nice
puke
patti smith
listing things that are a thing i don’t think is defining that thing
Eric, Mark puts on one of the best shows, often in spite of some kind of injury. Last one I went to I believe he pretty much broke his ankle or something and just did the rest of the show on his back on the floor.
“I felt too country to fuck.”
the first rule of punk is you do not talk about punk
i think you haven’t really thought much about the subject if you believe a declaration of best examples is not a tacit definition of the “thing”.
horse racing for example. if a person were to declare the 5 top racing horses in the world, does that not define what horse racing is by to some degree?
anyways, i am more curious to hear why blake made the distinction between writer and musician–obviously there is a back story lurking in the shadows…
Not this shit again.
lol
lol
hey, wow, look what english language can do: punk as shit // punk as(s) shit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Az-sD2zsePg
to me, the word “punk” is in the same category as the words “cunt” and “nigger” except that i still say “cunt” and “nigger” when i get mad…
who are the bands?
Sample sentence in dictionary at hand for “punk” as an adjective: “I felt too punk to eat.”
i’m actually now having trouble even naming one i would stand by in that way across the board
I’m seeing GBH next friday.
Who are the writers
Swans, Three 6 Mafia, Talking Heads, Wire
I’ll stand behind all those.
Throwing in The Crucifucks and Guttermouth.
Half Japanese, Beat Happening, R. Stevie Moore, Jonathan Richman
throbbing gristle, excepter, hair police, prurient, ornette coleman
The Feederz. The Shaggs. Devo. Harry Crews.
black fag
I’m book as fuck.
neil young is so punk it’s soft
Guttermouth; good addition. Saw the singer once have a hernia on stage and just down a handfull of pills from the audience, and kept on with the show.
if only all those writers started bands i mean you figure 4 guys a band suddenly you’ve increased the number of true punk outfits by 312.5%. maybe this whole punk thing will catch on after all.
converge? saw them play to an SLC crowd of about 20; jake tripped and split his head open on a step and kept screaming while blood gushed out of his head. finished the set while the ambulance waited outside
defining punk isn’t punk.
for some reason I could never really get into punk. I dunno what it is. I used to think it was some kind of personal failing like I’m not edgy enough or something to like punk or something. being punk is like being metal or something ridiculous, I always wanted to punch people and tell them to shut the fuck up who used described anything with those words, although I guess that would be a punk reaction, except come to think of it I never really punched anyone, just walked away muttering. maybe I’m missing the point of punk. probably I’m missing the point by looking for a point. but then again I like the talking heads but I never thought of them as punk, so maybe I just don’t understand “punk” as a word, just makes me think of punchable douchebags.
Guys, what about Green Day, right? Remember American Idiot? Those were heady days.
Ramones, Sex Pistols, Talking Heads
That’s the list
all of it
Clash
ornette coleman
nice
puke
patti smith
listing things that are a thing i don’t think is defining that thing
Eric, Mark puts on one of the best shows, often in spite of some kind of injury. Last one I went to I believe he pretty much broke his ankle or something and just did the rest of the show on his back on the floor.
eskorbuto, la mejor banda del mundo.
st. dad, the new best band in the world.
in a the latest issue of MRR, the reviewer’s first two sentences of the debut EP were: “No one can accuse these guys of not being punk. This shit rules.”
http://stdadyouth.blogspot.com/
punk writers:
Peter Sotos
Kenneth Goldsmith
Stewart Home
Tom McCarthy
Celine
George Bataille
J.G. Ballard
Dennis Cooper
Bret Easton Ellis
Richard Allen
Michael Herr
Phoebe Gloeckner
Jean Baudrillard
Anais Nin
Henry Miller
William S. Burroughs, Jr.
Will Eno
Richard Maxwell
Joan Didion
Stephen Dixon
Bill Flanagan
Aram Saroyan
Gilbert Sorrentino
Michel Houellebecq
Samuel Beckett
Edward Albee
PKD
Jim Knipfel
Slavoj Zizek
“I felt too country to fuck.”
the first rule of punk is you do not talk about punk
i think you haven’t really thought much about the subject if you believe a declaration of best examples is not a tacit definition of the “thing”.
horse racing for example. if a person were to declare the 5 top racing horses in the world, does that not define what horse racing is by to some degree?
anyways, i am more curious to hear why blake made the distinction between writer and musician–obviously there is a back story lurking in the shadows…
maggie’s farm is the punkest song ever
Not this shit again.
lol
lol
hey, wow, look what english language can do: punk as shit // punk as(s) shit.
Brett Easton Ellis?
which writers are “crust punk” tho… just wanna be crust punk… might finally get that “metaphorical Prince Albert” i’ve always wanted…
Bret
Punk Beckett:
“Noflag On”
“Waiting for Gutterpunk”
“(Mike) Watt”
“punk” doesn’t denigrate anyone tho
jk u guyz!!
i know you’re joking, but mike williams, the singer of eyehategod, has a book out called “cancer as a social activity” which is pretty good
most of the books on heartworm press are pretty “punk rock” if you were into arab on radar or american nightmare and some girls “back in the day”….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Az-sD2zsePg
to me, the word “punk” is in the same category as the words “cunt” and “nigger” except that i still say “cunt” and “nigger” when i get mad…
i always wondered about Mr Pottymouth’s book. it’s worth checking out?
Half Japanese, Beat Happening, R. Stevie Moore, Jonathan Richman
I like Home and Houellebecq. Home championed Swells. I’d say Swells was punker than them all.
yeah, if you’re into his lyrics i think you’d definitely dig it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RlG5_HDjKc
that video has him and wes eisold each reading one or two poems from their heartworm releases. eric paul reads a poem which his book is titled after and it’s one of my favorite poems of all time. eisold’s is pretty lame surprisingly…
after seeing your response to Paul, I’d say old man I’m a lot like you
Wall of Voodoo
are you being satirical or admitting your ignorance?
or keepin it real?
I’m book as fuck.
for some reason I could never really get into punk. I dunno what it is. I used to think it was some kind of personal failing like I’m not edgy enough or something to like punk or something. being punk is like being metal or something ridiculous, I always wanted to punch people and tell them to shut the fuck up who used described anything with those words, although I guess that would be a punk reaction, except come to think of it I never really punched anyone, just walked away muttering. maybe I’m missing the point of punk. probably I’m missing the point by looking for a point. but then again I like the talking heads but I never thought of them as punk, so maybe I just don’t understand “punk” as a word, just makes me think of punchable douchebags.
rad, thank you sir. i did like his. i’ll have to do a buy
eskorbuto, la mejor banda del mundo.
st. dad, the new best band in the world.
in a the latest issue of MRR, the reviewer’s first two sentences of the debut EP were: “No one can accuse these guys of not being punk. This shit rules.”
http://stdadyouth.blogspot.com/
punk writers:
Peter Sotos
Kenneth Goldsmith
Stewart Home
Tom McCarthy
Celine
George Bataille
J.G. Ballard
Dennis Cooper
Bret Easton Ellis
Richard Allen
Michael Herr
Phoebe Gloeckner
Jean Baudrillard
Anais Nin
Henry Miller
William S. Burroughs, Jr.
Will Eno
Richard Maxwell
Joan Didion
Stephen Dixon
Bill Flanagan
Aram Saroyan
Gilbert Sorrentino
Michel Houellebecq
Samuel Beckett
Edward Albee
PKD
Jim Knipfel
Slavoj Zizek
B
punx’ve prolly read more good books than most people have seen the last episode of lost
maggie’s farm is the punkest song ever
Brett Easton Ellis?
which writers are “crust punk” tho… just wanna be crust punk… might finally get that “metaphorical Prince Albert” i’ve always wanted…
Bret
Punk Beckett:
“Noflag On”
“Waiting for Gutterpunk”
“(Mike) Watt”
which is probably why i don’t say it when i’m mad…
“punk” doesn’t denigrate anyone tho
you knowing, would ruin it…
jk u guyz!!
i know you’re joking, but mike williams, the singer of eyehategod, has a book out called “cancer as a social activity” which is pretty good
most of the books on heartworm press are pretty “punk rock” if you were into arab on radar or american nightmare and some girls “back in the day”….
up the punx
I always liked Wes Eisold’s writing.
blake, i’m coming back to this late at night, drunk. yr statement, clearly, is outrageous and dumb. i guess that being so annoyed by it — a statement meant to be annoying and provocatative on the face of it — probably says as much about me as about this thread. but: ARE YOU KIDDING.
a band like the mekons, for one, have every bit as much to say about making big formal moves at the same time as working between the larger presses/records and independents, as brian evenson. and come on, beat happening, the feelies, the lines, half japanese, television, the television personalities, the halo benders, the flaming lips, the xray specs, the raincoats, the vaselines, lifter puller, just to name a few, and so on, all these incredibly diverse bands — dude, the entire indie music scene cutting through the late seventies/eighties/nineties, punk or punk derived, paved the way — not the whole way, but a part of it — for the independent presses that exist today.
blake, i think yr terrific, but GRRR, what’s the point of saying shit like that. really, i’m asking.
here’s the feelies playing in philly a few weeks back. this is punk rock. doesn’t sound like any of those four bands you mentioned, or any of those several dozen writers, i’d guess, but this music means something.
httpv://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2K0eeP-qQk
cuz im mean
i heard that song at the bar down the street from my mom’s house one night
i always wondered about Mr Pottymouth’s book. it’s worth checking out?
i think you just reinforced in my mind a point i wasn’t wholeheartedly trying to make
getting drunk and arguing about how all music is shit is fun
but i do believe what i said
all those bands you named would be published in the conneticut review if content was form
even tho i like some of them
Bret Easton Ellis is so not punk.
Bret Easton Ellis is Giorgio Moroder music.
i also have to disagree that music publishing paved the way for books
i’d say the other way around
as well, if anything, music has made consumers less attentive to the word
audio wallpaper
I like Home and Houellebecq. Home championed Swells. I’d say Swells was punker than them all.
yeah, if you’re into his lyrics i think you’d definitely dig it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RlG5_HDjKc
that video has him and wes eisold each reading one or two poems from their heartworm releases. eric paul reads a poem which his book is titled after and it’s one of my favorite poems of all time. eisold’s is pretty lame surprisingly…
after seeing your response to Paul, I’d say old man I’m a lot like you
Wall of Voodoo
are you being satirical or admitting your ignorance?
or keepin it real?
rad, thank you sir. i did like his. i’ll have to do a buy
punx’ve prolly read more good books than most people have seen the last episode of lost
which is probably why i don’t say it when i’m mad…
you knowing, would ruin it…
up the punx
I always liked Wes Eisold’s writing.
if Wire and Talking Heads are punk then what bands were new wave. if swans, throbbing gristle, excepter, hair police, prurient and ornette coleman are punk then what bands played industrial music, harsh noise, free jazz! is prurient punk because he generates noise like anyone is able to do who has the ability to generate feedback? what is then merzbow? is the digital merzbow more punk than the analog merzbow was? what is prurient adding what masonna did at his times? is that punk?
ask ornette coleman what he thinks about punk rock.
ok punk is here in between “attitude” and “musical style” right?
green day? someone said green day? i was born too late to listen to punk music in early 80ies. the bands that i listened to in late 80ies were punk bands on their way down like dead kennedys, exploited, uk subs, gbh, circle jerks (hardcore?), descendents, bad religion (considered as punk during their first two lps), dri, half japanese and so on and so on. even that was not anylonger a authentic scene at that time, it was the surviving rest of energy punk and hardcore had.
but green day? the rip-off of the rip-off of the rip-off!
if you consider writers like slavoj zizek as punk because of “wild style of thinking” then question if his lifestyle is punk too! writing tons of books, sampling his articles into his books so many times, earning big money on conferences writing in special cd-editions about the opera and so on and so on.
i am not against all that but is this “punk”?
the only concert that i experienced as punk (thinking back) was early Boredoms. it was so destrucive that i feared to get hurt.
the more destructive the more “punk”?
is “free thinking” punk?
many of the bands (i mentioned above) are very conservative thinking about music compared to bands from today. so what is punk today?
attitude? what attitude? political? autonomy?
radicalism?
can we compare radicalism in music to radicalism in literature? i am not able. help out!
can we compare radicalism in music? if punk means attitude, autonomy and radicalism are/were the following bands/artists PUNK? And how many radical writers have we against that?
Agencement, AMMusic, Alboth, Albert Ayler, Derek Bailey, Husker Du, Iannis Xenakis, Laibach, John Cage, GG Allin, Anti Group, Pan Sonic, Mars, DNA, Teenage Jesus and the Jerks, Lydia Lunch, Killdozer,Masonna, Andrew Chalk, Organum, Asmus Tietchens, King Crimson, John Zorn, Einstürzende Neubauten, Wolf Eyes, Morton Feldman, Harry Partch, John Cage, Haters, Big City Orchestra, Walter Marchetti, Christian Marclay, Flipper, Chrome, Guru Guru, Jimi Hendrix, John Coltrane, Current 93, SPK, Whitehouse, Grouper, Eliane Radigue, Maryanne Amacher, Frank Zappe, The Fugs, This Heat, Zoviet France, The Melvins, Boredoms, Hanatarash, Test Department,
The Pop Group, Mark Stewart & Maffia, Little Annie, Crass, Velvet Underground, Ground Zero, Talk Talk, Sonic Youth, Red Crayola, Black Flag, Nurse With Wound, Ornette Coleman, Oval, Jim O`Rourke, No Means No, Skaters, P16D4, Mission of Burma, Bad Brains, Big Black, Blind Idiot God, Devo, Carcass, Richard Hell, The Ex, Stooges, MC 5, MDC, Minor Threat, Minutemen, Motorhead, Pere Ubu, Sham 69, Skeleton Crew, Fred Frith, Anthony Braxton, Yellow Swans, Victims Family, Wire, Throbbing Gristle, The Slits, Sore Throat, Steel Pole Bath Tub, Violent Femmes, Idea Fire Company, Troum, Black To Comm, Napalm Death, Darkthrone, Burzum, The Stranglers, Elliott Sharp, Zeena Parkins, Ikue Mori, Xela, Suicide, Alan Vega, Corrupted, Sun o))), Earth, Black Dice… I stop here for a moment cuase I am exhausted… ah by the way:
Exhausted, Godflesh, Godspeed You Black Emperor, A Silver Mt. Zion, Grey Daturas, Nadja, Ovo, Thrones, The Ramones, Pregant Babys Pregnant with Pregnant Babys, Alva Noto and so on and so on….
i am mean things i say all the time.
“Dropkick Murphy”
blake, i’m coming back to this late at night, drunk. yr statement, clearly, is outrageous and dumb. i guess that being so annoyed by it — a statement meant to be annoying and provocatative on the face of it — probably says as much about me as about this thread. but: ARE YOU KIDDING.
a band like the mekons, for one, have every bit as much to say about making big formal moves at the same time as working between the larger presses/records and independents, as brian evenson. and come on, beat happening, the feelies, the lines, half japanese, television, the television personalities, the halo benders, the flaming lips, the xray specs, the raincoats, the vaselines, lifter puller, just to name a few, and so on, all these incredibly diverse bands — dude, the entire indie music scene cutting through the late seventies/eighties/nineties, punk or punk derived, paved the way — not the whole way, but a part of it — for the independent presses that exist today.
blake, i think yr terrific, but GRRR, what’s the point of saying shit like that. really, i’m asking.
here’s the feelies playing in philly a few weeks back. this is punk rock. doesn’t sound like any of those four bands you mentioned, or any of those several dozen writers, i’d guess, but this music means something.
httpv://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2K0eeP-qQk
Hanatarash 1988
cuz im mean
i heard that song at the bar down the street from my mom’s house one night
i think you just reinforced in my mind a point i wasn’t wholeheartedly trying to make
getting drunk and arguing about how all music is shit is fun
but i do believe what i said
all those bands you named would be published in the conneticut review if content was form
even tho i like some of them
Bret Easton Ellis is so not punk.
Bret Easton Ellis is Giorgio Moroder music.
i also have to disagree that music publishing paved the way for books
i’d say the other way around
as well, if anything, music has made consumers less attentive to the word
audio wallpaper
If Ramones hadn’t done Rock and Roll Highschool, I’d be more apt to agree with them being on that list.
I always thought Nina Simone was one of the most punk musicians of all time. Mississippi Goddam is punk as fuck. (One of many examples.)
“Fugazzles”
“Oy-hio Impropagandhi”
if Wire and Talking Heads are punk then what bands were new wave. if swans, throbbing gristle, excepter, hair police, prurient and ornette coleman are punk then what bands played industrial music, harsh noise, free jazz! is prurient punk because he generates noise like anyone is able to do who has the ability to generate feedback? what is then merzbow? is the digital merzbow more punk than the analog merzbow was? what is prurient adding what masonna did at his times? is that punk?
ask ornette coleman what he thinks about punk rock.
ok punk is here in between “attitude” and “musical style” right?
green day? someone said green day? i was born too late to listen to punk music in early 80ies. the bands that i listened to in late 80ies were punk bands on their way down like dead kennedys, exploited, uk subs, gbh, circle jerks (hardcore?), descendents, bad religion (considered as punk during their first two lps), dri, half japanese and so on and so on. even that was not anylonger a authentic scene at that time, it was the surviving rest of energy punk and hardcore had.
but green day? the rip-off of the rip-off of the rip-off!
if you consider writers like slavoj zizek as punk because of “wild style of thinking” then question if his lifestyle is punk too! writing tons of books, sampling his articles into his books so many times, earning big money on conferences writing in special cd-editions about the opera and so on and so on.
i am not against all that but is this “punk”?
the only concert that i experienced as punk (thinking back) was early Boredoms. it was so destrucive that i feared to get hurt.
the more destructive the more “punk”?
is “free thinking” punk?
many of the bands (i mentioned above) are very conservative thinking about music compared to bands from today. so what is punk today?
attitude? what attitude? political? autonomy?
radicalism?
can we compare radicalism in music to radicalism in literature? i am not able. help out!
can we compare radicalism in music? if punk means attitude, autonomy and radicalism are/were the following bands/artists PUNK? And how many radical writers have we against that?
Agencement, AMMusic, Alboth, Albert Ayler, Derek Bailey, Husker Du, Iannis Xenakis, Laibach, John Cage, GG Allin, Anti Group, Pan Sonic, Mars, DNA, Teenage Jesus and the Jerks, Lydia Lunch, Killdozer,Masonna, Andrew Chalk, Organum, Asmus Tietchens, King Crimson, John Zorn, Einstürzende Neubauten, Wolf Eyes, Morton Feldman, Harry Partch, John Cage, Haters, Big City Orchestra, Walter Marchetti, Christian Marclay, Flipper, Chrome, Guru Guru, Jimi Hendrix, John Coltrane, Current 93, SPK, Whitehouse, Grouper, Eliane Radigue, Maryanne Amacher, Frank Zappe, The Fugs, This Heat, Zoviet France, The Melvins, Boredoms, Hanatarash, Test Department,
The Pop Group, Mark Stewart & Maffia, Little Annie, Crass, Velvet Underground, Ground Zero, Talk Talk, Sonic Youth, Red Crayola, Black Flag, Nurse With Wound, Ornette Coleman, Oval, Jim O`Rourke, No Means No, Skaters, P16D4, Mission of Burma, Bad Brains, Big Black, Blind Idiot God, Devo, Carcass, Richard Hell, The Ex, Stooges, MC 5, MDC, Minor Threat, Minutemen, Motorhead, Pere Ubu, Sham 69, Skeleton Crew, Fred Frith, Anthony Braxton, Yellow Swans, Victims Family, Wire, Throbbing Gristle, The Slits, Sore Throat, Steel Pole Bath Tub, Violent Femmes, Idea Fire Company, Troum, Black To Comm, Napalm Death, Darkthrone, Burzum, The Stranglers, Elliott Sharp, Zeena Parkins, Ikue Mori, Xela, Suicide, Alan Vega, Corrupted, Sun o))), Earth, Black Dice… I stop here for a moment cuase I am exhausted… ah by the way:
Exhausted, Godflesh, Godspeed You Black Emperor, A Silver Mt. Zion, Grey Daturas, Nadja, Ovo, Thrones, The Ramones, Pregant Babys Pregnant with Pregnant Babys, Alva Noto and so on and so on….
Hanatarash 1988
Sex Pistols, Circle Jerks, Butthole Surfers, Dee Dee Ramone.
Gertrude Stein was a total punk. So was Joyce. I think the Left Bank in Paris during the 20s is comparable to London during the 70s as far as punk goes.
Punk died a long time ago I think, as far as music goes. I used to go to concerts by guys like DRI, MDC etc. Those were the US punk bands. But after Ronald was out of office punk died, because he was what really fed the scene: Ronald hate. A kid walking down the street in 2010 in some suburban town surrounded by corn does not a punk make.
c.e. I can forgive them the bad film because of the rest
This punk writer thing is more interesting as a parlor game if you are talking about punk as attitude as well as content.
For example = Dennis Cooper, Gertrude Stein, the earlier William S. Burroughs, Al Blaster Ackerman are punk.
Bret Easton Ellis, James Joyce, the cottage industry of late WSB, H.L. Mencken are notpunk.
I’m way older than most of you and remember my dad getting really angry when my brothers and I called
each other punks. Punk did not mean musical style yet. It meant gunsel. So, anyway, it can be derogatory.
Henry Green, Mavis Gallant, Stendhal…all punk.
If Ramones hadn’t done Rock and Roll Highschool, I’d be more apt to agree with them being on that list.
I always found Gertrude Stein’s work surprisingly conservative considering her reputation.
Stendhal ha ha love it!
And what about Ginsberg? (except he was chubby, and I always think of punk as a scrawny aesthetic. with “bad” hair and worse skin. unless you were chrissie hynde who had good skin)
and really good hair (ref. chrissie)
I can think of at least several dozen writers that are new wave as fuck.
there are many ways to be liberal
I always thought Nina Simone was one of the most punk musicians of all time. Mississippi Goddam is punk as fuck. (One of many examples.)
Billy Childish.
I was thinking of Stein and Joyce as punk writers in terms of how they lived as much as their writing. Punk as lifestyle. I think it’s an important distinction.
I forgot to add Bob Dobbs and The Church of the Subgenius.
“Fugazzles”
“Oy-hio Impropagandhi”
Joyce in his life though wasn’t that radical. Stein had a girlfriend, but aside from that she didn’t seem that far out. Someone like Alfred Jarry seems more to fit the punk label.
Gertrude Stein sat in plush chairs surrounded by expensive art. Just because she was a lesbo don’t make her punk. Try Genet, he was a homo and lived a punk lifestyle. I’m reading Thief’s Journal now. It’s great.
A pretty ridiculous conversation.
Punk was in-your-face direct emotion from scarcely educated working class musicians who weren’t musicians.
Some say “Jailhouse Rock” was the first movie to embody the punk aesthetic, in that you had the Elvis character destroying his guitar, founding his own record company, snubbing a geeky bourgie professor at a cocktaily party, and so on.
The punk DIY anarchic aesthetic was the inspiration for the 90’s zine explosion, which was the foundation of the Underground Literary Alliance.
Is Maximum Rock n Roll still around?
To suggest Bret Ellis, Joan Didion! et.al. as in any way punk shows an inability to understand what you’re talking about.
(The word “punk” re music was first used regarding Sixties garage rock, the Nuggets collection etc. Appropriate that garage rock is strongest right now in Detroit, which spawned several bands who inspired the Seventies version of punk rock. Namely, Iggy and MC5 most prominently, but many other great ur-punk Detroit bands like The Underdogs.)
Punk is an attitude. Hard to see its like in any of today’s go-along-to-get-along approved writing crowd.
Just my two cents, take it for what you want.
punk sells fashion:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4Gh-GH8Miw
punk gets dressed up and puts on makeup and paves the way for madonna to wear a wedding dress:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_7VgDSNxlGU
mayakovsky
Sex Pistols, Circle Jerks, Butthole Surfers, Dee Dee Ramone.
maximum rock n roll is still around but it’s totally irrelevant & pretty much sucks nowadays
Gertrude Stein was a total punk. So was Joyce. I think the Left Bank in Paris during the 20s is comparable to London during the 70s as far as punk goes.
Punk died a long time ago I think, as far as music goes. I used to go to concerts by guys like DRI, MDC etc. Those were the US punk bands. But after Ronald was out of office punk died, because he was what really fed the scene: Ronald hate. A kid walking down the street in 2010 in some suburban town surrounded by corn does not a punk make.
c.e. I can forgive them the bad film because of the rest
This punk writer thing is more interesting as a parlor game if you are talking about punk as attitude as well as content.
For example = Dennis Cooper, Gertrude Stein, the earlier William S. Burroughs, Al Blaster Ackerman are punk.
Bret Easton Ellis, James Joyce, the cottage industry of late WSB, H.L. Mencken are notpunk.
I’m way older than most of you and remember my dad getting really angry when my brothers and I called
each other punks. Punk did not mean musical style yet. It meant gunsel. So, anyway, it can be derogatory.
Henry Green, Mavis Gallant, Stendhal…all punk.
I always found Gertrude Stein’s work surprisingly conservative considering her reputation.
Stendhal ha ha love it!
And what about Ginsberg? (except he was chubby, and I always think of punk as a scrawny aesthetic. with “bad” hair and worse skin. unless you were chrissie hynde who had good skin)
and really good hair (ref. chrissie)
I can think of at least several dozen writers that are new wave as fuck.
there are many ways to be liberal
Billy Childish.
I was thinking of Stein and Joyce as punk writers in terms of how they lived as much as their writing. Punk as lifestyle. I think it’s an important distinction.
sure do like those Hot Snakes
I forgot to add Bob Dobbs and The Church of the Subgenius.
Joyce in his life though wasn’t that radical. Stein had a girlfriend, but aside from that she didn’t seem that far out. Someone like Alfred Jarry seems more to fit the punk label.
Gertrude Stein sat in plush chairs surrounded by expensive art. Just because she was a lesbo don’t make her punk. Try Genet, he was a homo and lived a punk lifestyle. I’m reading Thief’s Journal now. It’s great.
A pretty ridiculous conversation.
Punk was in-your-face direct emotion from scarcely educated working class musicians who weren’t musicians.
Some say “Jailhouse Rock” was the first movie to embody the punk aesthetic, in that you had the Elvis character destroying his guitar, founding his own record company, snubbing a geeky bourgie professor at a cocktaily party, and so on.
The punk DIY anarchic aesthetic was the inspiration for the 90’s zine explosion, which was the foundation of the Underground Literary Alliance.
Is Maximum Rock n Roll still around?
To suggest Bret Ellis, Joan Didion! et.al. as in any way punk shows an inability to understand what you’re talking about.
(The word “punk” re music was first used regarding Sixties garage rock, the Nuggets collection etc. Appropriate that garage rock is strongest right now in Detroit, which spawned several bands who inspired the Seventies version of punk rock. Namely, Iggy and MC5 most prominently, but many other great ur-punk Detroit bands like The Underdogs.)
Punk is an attitude. Hard to see its like in any of today’s go-along-to-get-along approved writing crowd.
Just my two cents, take it for what you want.
punk sells fashion:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4Gh-GH8Miw
punk gets dressed up and puts on makeup and paves the way for madonna to wear a wedding dress:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_7VgDSNxlGU
mayakovsky
maximum rock n roll is still around but it’s totally irrelevant & pretty much sucks nowadays
totally fuckin forgot about Kool Keith
sure do like those Hot Snakes
“Sat in plush chairs surrounded by expensive art.”
Channeling Wenclas are we? I agree about Stein. I’ll take Djuna Barnes any day over her. In general. Not for punk cred.
Anyway, I read Thief’s Journal. It’s good.
No one commenting on your blog now so you come back here? What is it with you and Elvis? Dude, Elvis was all about his pinche Mama and being respectful and shit. Nothing punk about that. Dying on the shitter is pretty punk, though, so you might be onto something.
totally fuckin forgot about Kool Keith
Crucifucks… lookout. Didn’t expect that name to pop up. All praise Doc Corbin Dart.
“Sat in plush chairs surrounded by expensive art.”
Channeling Wenclas are we? I agree about Stein. I’ll take Djuna Barnes any day over her. In general. Not for punk cred.
Anyway, I read Thief’s Journal. It’s good.
No one commenting on your blog now so you come back here? What is it with you and Elvis? Dude, Elvis was all about his pinche Mama and being respectful and shit. Nothing punk about that. Dying on the shitter is pretty punk, though, so you might be onto something.
the stooges. I will stand the fuck by the stooges.
devo! you win.
no kathy acker?
or hubert selby, jr
Crucifucks… lookout. Didn’t expect that name to pop up. All praise Doc Corbin Dart.
the stooges. I will stand the fuck by the stooges.
devo! you win.
no kathy acker?
or hubert selby, jr
agreement.
agreement.